CED Digest Vol. 2 No. 48

CED Digest Vol. 2 No. 48 • 11/29/1997
Date: Sun, 23 Nov 1997 17:58:05 -0600
From: Geoff Oltmans 
To: Tom Howe <ceds@teleport.com>
Subject: Re: CED Digest Vol. 2 No. 47

>      The CED Future: Part  Ten Forming of a  Corporation   In the last few
> digests it  has been pointed out, about the feasibilty of restarting our
> old, obsolete, but  great system.  After extensive research it has been
> found that publishing  current films would be outside a realistic grasp.  I
> do however believe, as  well as other who believe, that it is realistic and
> possible to restart the  manufacture of diamond stylus needles for our
> players.    Recently I asked those who  would interested to form into

Here's another "negative" comment, or constructive criticism if you
will.

I don't really think it feasable to manufacture the needles as well! For
one thing, I can't think of ANY manufacturers making stylii for
phonographs let alone CED players (there is definitely a surplus of
stylii for phonographs around). For one thing, a CED stylus is NOTHING
like a diamond-tipped phonograph stylus. It is many times more complex.
It is cut a very specific way in order to let it ride on several grooves
unlike a phonograph stylus. Secondly, it has a titanium electrode which
extends into the groove. This is much smaller than the diamond tip.
There is a connecting wire that is attached to a gold-plated point
contact. There are three pieces of magnet used for tracking, and a
rubber stabilizer on the back. There is a cylindrical hollow aluminum
tube used to hold the needle to the cartridge. There's also a spring
used to retract the needle when loading/unloading the cartridge from the
player. That's a lot of various parts to assemble! The only other
alternative would be to cut down on the number of parts necessary to
manufacture by refurbishing cartridges. Even still, it seems rather
cost-prohibitive.

The CED FAQ states that, "Note that to date it has been less expensive
to buy a working CED player than to buy a new stylus
cartridge (my range has been $5 to $30 for used players vs. $45 to $70
for new stylus cartridges)." Now, if it costs $45 to $70 for a new
stylus from BACKSTOCK that's at least 10-15 years old...how could it be
economically feasable to manufacture a new cartridge (indeed several
models of cartridges, since all the different brands use a different
style cartridge) for the much reduced user base of today?

*Geoff!*

------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: "Zach D." 
To: Tom Howe <ceds@teleport.com>
Date: Mon, 24 Nov 1997 00:15:07 -0500
Subject: Digest entry

Well, here is another topic for discussion for the digest.  The bring 
back the CED campaign is interesting (1.8 million dollars! That would 
almost pay back my school loans) but perhaps you guys have some 
thoughts on shipping disks..

Everyone knows that if the disks get stacked too high the sheer 
weight of the disks can cause the outer case to mash the disk and 
possibley scratch and damage it right?  

But, just because you put the disks 'upright' in a box doesn't really 
mean anything when you think about it... I asked UPS about 'This side 
up' and they told me 'no way'... they said the boxes are tossed, 
rolled down belts, and what not with absolutely no reguard for 'this 
side up' labels.  So, if you have your disks neatly stacked 'up 
right' they may soon be neatly stacked on top of eachother once the 
box is turned over.. and since you stacked them all together thinking 
they are safe, they really aren't.

So - I've been thinking about this...  Why not just stack the disks 
about 4-5 at a time, and then put something to pad the four corners 
of the disk, and then stack 4-5 more?  If you open the case and 
inspect the amount of space outside the circumfrence of the disk but 
inside the corner of the outer case you will see it's plenty of space 
a wad of paper, a piece of styrofoam, etc.  Plus the left and 
ride edges of the disk are solid plastic. 

Do you see what I am getting at?  The disks can only be crushed in 
the middle.. so if the outside where there is no disk is padded right 
then the pressure from a stack of CED's can be distributed to the 
corners on each stack of five or so disks.  Same concept used with 
those t.v. stands that distribute the weight of the set more towards 
the edges of you entertainment center so it doesn't bow in the 
middle.  

Anyways, something to think about!  I'd like to hear why that will or 
won't work.  Of course, no way to no really know whether it works or 
not unless you want to take pictures of the disks and record the play 
quality, ship them to yourself along with a control batch and then 
re-check to see if there is any damage.  But hey, it's fun to 
theorize right??!

TTYL,
ZD
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
                 The Net's Best Virtual Flea Market: 
   Vinyl-8 Tracks-Computers-Board Games-CEDs-Video Games-Books - Collectibles
                http://users.hub.ofthe.net/~zachd/

------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: "andrew bendel" 
To: ceds@teleport.com
Subject: Bring back CED?  How about saving what we've got?
Date: Mon, 24 Nov 1997 06:58:03 PST

Tom, I'm concerned that the effort by your CED group is misplaced in 
trying to spend time and money to resurrect the CED format.  It cannot 
be done.  However, there IS a format that is dying before our eyes -- or 
maybe I should say being killed off before our eyes.  It is the 
laserdisc format.  If your group wants to support a disc, why not try to 
keep the laserdisc from going into extinction?  Companies that are 
pushing the DVD are currently trying to make EVERY audio/video format 
obsolete.  They want the DVD to replace laserdiscs, VHS tapes, CDs, and 
audio cassettes.  Partly because the DVD has a little technical edge in 
some areas.  But the push is mostly a desire to make money.  Can you 
redirect your group (or expand it to include laserdiscs?)  Thanks!
-  Andy Bendel  

------------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Mon, 24 Nov 1997 20:31:37 -0500 (EST)
From: return 
To: Tom Howe <ceds@teleport.com>
Subject: Re:  CED SERVICE TECH CENTER!!

  Guys listen up:

    Lets carefully consider this point.  Lets assume for a moment that for
what ever the reason the CED operation is not started back-up again
(whether the reason is because of cost, lack of interest, lack of will,
lack of practicality, lack of unifying everyone or whatever).
    Then, this is something we better do, and we can do, and I think we
can get the aggreement of all!, that what we "CAN" do is create under the
same ROOF is this:
  We need a "C.E.D. SERVICE CENTER!!!
  We need a telephone support line of Technicans to TELL or advise us how
to Troubleshoot and repair our Machines!!!!!  Now guys, there is no sense
in so many people out there with machine problems with nobody to turn to!!
   If you have got a collection of disc and your machine "CRASHES" what
are you going to do then!!!!!
   you need an office or an operation set up in conjuction with the
people (in some way shape or form) that will be making replacement
styluses and spare parts for these machines!!!
   in addition to this,,, we could use a "Competent" Service center set up
of Technicans!! who know how to work on our Machines!!!!
We, need to seek out and contact either "Retired" or used to be employed
RCA techs who really knew how to work on these things.  We need a phone
line set up for tech advice, or the option of sending in your machine to
be repaired!!!( for a reasonable fee or other arrangements- workable).

    I don't believe it fair to all the rest of the people out there who
are trying to and want to maintian there machines to not have any
resouces to rely upon when they are trying to figure it out!! Its not fair
for
just a few out there to know how to fix something on a machine and others
don't!!  There needs to be an open and fair outlet for all people to be
able to repair their machines with good technical help for those people
(I'm refering to you and I).

  We all know the problem of "Current Service Tech's" Not knowing how to
work on the machines, and then trying to charge an arm and a leg if that!

  This can be done!! its practical!!!  Its feasible!! its workable!! and I
think its time it was done!!!  There's no sense in this stuff!! there's no
excuse for this going on the way it is!!!--
  And for those out there that are "Brushing" this off right know are
being Foolish!!! Your machine will break down sooner or later (whether
its mechanical or electronic!!) and then what are you going to do?????(you
can't just look for another machine every time this happens!)

  Prehaps,  we first need to worry about getting the organization going
first that will AID or help us keep the existing machines running with
parts and """GOOD OLE FASHIONED  service Tech's we can rely on!!!!"""

    We need to get this going atleast!!! ...
  
  I want all of you to reply and provide some  "constructive" input to as
how we get the ball rolling on this.

  Lets try to start making sense on this..

  We need a Service outlet for our Machines (with the spare parts we are
talking about right now).  

   As the old saying goes, "WE NEED SERVICE!!!!!"

     Lets get ourselves together on this!   (can we atleast do this
much!!!???)     

------------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Wed, 26 Nov 1997 03:26:12 -0800
From: Tom Howe 
To: ceds@teleport.com
Subject: New VideoDisc Article

Hi All:

I just came across an article in the October 1997 issue of _Popular Mechanics_ 
titled  "Think It's New? Think Again!"  that mentions SelectaVision. This
article compares DVD to the earlier formats, and discusses a needle-based
format from 1941 that I wasn't even aware of. This format used 10" discs rotating at
100 rpm to produce 1 minute of B&W video per disc. In a  photo, a lady is shown
operating a giant video juke box-- the intended market for the short playing
discs. This was reprinted from the December 1941 issue, so the advent of World
War 2 ended any plans to market the system.

--Tom Howe

------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: "Daniel P. Cayea" 
To: "Tom Howe" <ceds@teleport.com>
Subject: The CED Future, Part Twelve
Date: Wed, 26 Nov 1997 09:16:01 -0500

The CED Future
(The NCDL Newsletter, CED Project)
Part Twelve: One Step Closer
By: Daniel P. Cayea

	For eleven previous updates I have written about the 'The CED Future'. 
This time I write to tell you about my discoveries in the finding CED
manufacturing systems and hardware.  Many have made many suggestions that
the public interest corporation, 'Capacitance Corporation' that we have for
the project of keeping our system ongoing.  Some of the suggestions that
were made, were such that our PIC (Public Interest Corporation) offer an
electronics company an offer to remanufacture diamond stylus cartridges.  I
have contacted several electronics companies, such as Digi-Key, whom
haven't heard of our cartridges and hence them wouldn't say anything about
the possibility of remanufacture.  
	Amung the other questions that you have asked me through your replies to
'The CED Future' or to your constructive criticism, such as where is the
pressing machines that RCA had, or would we go along in the enhancement of
our system?  I have some answers and suggestions.  As for the disc pressing
machine which has been put lower on the list of priorities, as I am sure
that somewhere in storage at Thomson Consumer Electronics it lies.  However
I jump to other question about, how can we enhance our obsolete media. 
>From my personal understanding in the system, the video and sound signals
are derived from certain conductors (loosely speaking) in the needle relay
the signals to be diciphered.  How does this apply to the enhancement of
our system?  I have a project that I would like all of you to help me with.
 According to Tom Howe's FAQ on the CED Magic series of pages, that the
standard revolutions per minute (RPM) for the RCA CED Player is 450. 
Others have suggested that since our media is a contact media that it may
not sustain a higher number of RPM's.  I opt this, that those with broken
players and useless stylus cartriges try to increase the RPM number of the
turntables by some means or another, load the needle into position. 
Increase the revolutions per minute until the needle is no longer stable on
the disc.  In what I mean by stable is that the needle will smoothly ride
the groove of the discs.  I figure after increasing the RPM's to a certain
amount that 10 seconds before instability is reached use that RPM number as
the highest stability point.  I have done the experiment and have found
some promising results.  However before I release the results, I'd like you
to perform the same experiment if possible during your free time and send
me your results as well.  After getting at least 5 different results I will
publish them in a future edition of the CED Future, or post them in general
in CED Digest.  It is seriously figured that if the RPM level for the discs
can be increased, the playback time of the disc is increased as well as
video & sound quality improved.
	On to another subject in our quest to improve our nostalgic system.  The
footwork of improvement.  I have read many articles of constructive
critisicism on this project.  I have read of those who believe that this
project is futile, and I have read criticism about those who think that
this project is positive and novel.  I thank both parties for their
constructive criticism, however footwork is what is required.  Over the
past few weeks I have done several projects and contact several
organizations and companies reporting my results, yet haven't gotten any
results from those who believed that this is the novel project.  I conclude
that I must have support either physical or financial from those who also
agree with the plans of my project.  Support is not your responsibility for
this project, yet more promising results in less time would occur if you
could offer your support.  Again I thank those who have offered your
support and I intend to keep you updated as much as possible.

Dan Cayea
Telecom Technologies Incorporated
CED Systems Re-enactment Project

*This message authenticated and originated from Telecom Technologies
Headquarters. TTI is located in Lyon Mountain, New York USA (Authenticated
2841-0090) Unauthorized use of this signature is prohibited)

------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: "Daniel P. Cayea" 
To: "Tom Howe" <ceds@teleport.com>
Subject: NCDL Library
Date: Fri, 28 Nov 1997 23:16:58 -0500

     Dear CED'ers.  Again, like last week I am writing to inform you  of the
NCDL Library. The National Capacitance Disc Library  (non-government) I have
created for those who haven't the luxury of viewing the  films on CED that they
wish. As I am seeking donations, which are gladly  accepted I will soon be
incorporating my own collection into the  libraries. If you wish to subscribe
to the NCDL Newsletter send an e mail  to <mailto:cayead@westelcom.com>
cayead@westelcom.com with the words  SUBSCRIBE NCDL in the subject line. 
Sincerely Dan Cayea  *This message authenticated and originated from  Telecom
Technologies Headquarters. TTI is located in Lyon Mountain, New York USA 
(Authenticated 2841-0090) Unauthorized use of this signature is  prohibited)

------------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Sat, 29 Nov 1997 07:15:47 -0800
From: Tom Howe 
To: ceds@teleport.com
Subject: Holiday CED's

Fellow Collectors:

For the holidays I've updated the Featured CED to "The Nutcracker" (both
versions actually). Also included in this feature is a list of all the CED
titles that relate to the holidays.

--Tom Howe
http://www.cedmagic.com
Previous Digest | Next Digest | Volume 2 Index | CED Magic Home